Watch the DumpBachmann Censors - Live! (Recorded earlier)
My little experiement in political censorship and comment manipulation at DumpBachmann is now complete, but feel free to browse the blow-by-blow account below (remember, read from the bottom up!)
Final Update, 10:45pm EST: But wait - we have our answer! As I was typing the last update, Eva posted a comment here at Weiner Watch which confirms that she has no intention of allowing my latest comment in the DumpBachmann thread! In other words, she freely admits that she's censoring my response, and she thinks she can avoid charges of censorship by posting it here - edited of course, with her own comments interspersed.
Unlike Eva, I'll keep her comment as is - I have nothing to hide. Specifically, I'm not hiding the inconvenient fact that my contributors are using my blog to advance the financial interests of light rail construction firms.
But this will be my final update, because my point is made: Eva Young is a censor who manipulates her discussions to advance her causes. In my particular case, her "cause" is promoting light rail by smearing PRT, and when I point out the obvious flaws in her propaganda, she uses comment moderation to manipulate the debate in her favor.
Lesson: Do not trust political hack blogs like DumpBachmann, and, more generally, never trust any forum moderated by propagandists like Eva Young and Ken Avidor, especially in cases like this where they have a possible financial conflict of interest.
It's too bad that the task of criticising Michele Bachmann, a politician overripe for criticism, falls into the incapable and corrupt hands of the DumpBachmann folks.
Update, 10:21pm EST: My second comment seems to have been ignored, much as the first was for nearly 6 hours. Since I posted the second comment almost 2 hours ago, two other comments from "friendly" jonerik have appeared on the DB, while my comment is still in limbo. Maybe Eva's editing it as we speak, or maybe she's holding onto it for a few more hours until it's stale enough that it doesn't appear on the "recent comments" list.
Update, 8:38pm EST: I have just submitted the following comment to the comments section. Let's see how long it takes to appear. Anyone want to start a pool? :-)
Update, 8:02pm EST: Now things get interesting! My comment finally appears - but not in its original form! It's been edited so that Eva's response is interspersed inline with my own!
And, of course, her comments don't deny anything, but simply repeat the same old Eva/Avidor anti-PRT talking points. For example, Eva uses the ridiculous tactic of associating PRT with creationism. This tactic was borrowed from Ken's corporate light rail buddies at Light Rail Now, who derisively refer to PRT proponents as "gadgetbahners" and "zealots". She also questions why there would be an "attack blog" against a "private citizen" - conveniently ignoring the fact that Ken Avidor has plastered his image across the Internet as the so-called "leading skeptic" on PRT.
Also notice that my comment has appeared with the original timestamp of nearly 6 hours ago - meaning that it appears way down the list of "recent comments". This is Eva's way of burying my comment so readers can't see it. Contrast this with official DBTO dare2sayit.com, whose comment was approved immediately and appeared at the top of the "recent comments" list.
Eva closes her comment manipulation with this decree:
In other words: Eva won't engage in a debate which she cannot win, so even though the original post is less than a day old, she has closed comments.
But I'm not willing to let it end there. Stay tuned. :-)
Update, 7:28pm EST: We're well into our 6th hour waiting for my comment to appear. In the last hour, two additional comments have been approved: one from DB supporter "Doug", and also one from critic "dare2sayit.com", who nicely fills the role of official DumpBachmann token opposition (DBTO).
See, Eva Young wants you to think she allows criticism in her blog comments. So she's found an idealogue blogger from the other side - the official DBTO - whom she regularly props up as evidence that she's not a censor. She even has a link to DBTO's own blog displayed on DB.
Why was dare2sayit selected as DBTO? Simple: because dare2sayit has strong, extreme opinions that are easy to attack and debunk. They'd never have me as DBTO, because my opinions are not extreme, nor do I post ideological rants. My posts are centered in fact, and often debunk their own inflammatory rhetoric.
In short: I will never be DBTO, because they don't want you to see what I write.
I often wonder if dare2sayit is actually a plant - i.e. one of the DB contributors posing as opposition to make the other side to look bad. Normally I wouldn't jump to such conclusions (I like to think that most bloggers are above such petty manipulations), but DumpBachmann contributor Ken Avidor has a long history of such deceptions.
In any case, we now have a total of four comments approved since I submitted mine over five hours ago, including one from the official DBTO, yet mine is still censored.
Update, 6:08pm EST: Exactly four hours have passed, and my comment is still censored. But it's early yet - in the past I've waited days for critical comments to get past the DumpBachmann censors.
Update, 4:55pm EST: Going on three hours now, and my comment is still censored. No other comments have appeared either... I wonder how many other critical comments are "awaiting moderation" along with mine?
Update, 3:58pm EST: Nearly two hours later, and my comment has not yet appeared. In the meantime, two supportive comments from "Eric Z" have appeared on other DumpBachmann posts, so obviously someone is moderating. Conclusion: my comment is currently censored.
Initial post, 2:08pm EST: Ten minutes ago, I submitted a comment to this absurd DumpBachmann post. Now lets watch the DumpBachmann "moderators" (censors) at work.
I'll post updates throughout the day. We'll see how long it takes for my comment to appear, and how many other supportive comments get approved while my criticism is held back. Updates will appear at the top of this entry, so hit the refresh key often!
For reference, here is the comment I posted:
Final Update, 10:45pm EST: But wait - we have our answer! As I was typing the last update, Eva posted a comment here at Weiner Watch which confirms that she has no intention of allowing my latest comment in the DumpBachmann thread! In other words, she freely admits that she's censoring my response, and she thinks she can avoid charges of censorship by posting it here - edited of course, with her own comments interspersed.
Unlike Eva, I'll keep her comment as is - I have nothing to hide. Specifically, I'm not hiding the inconvenient fact that my contributors are using my blog to advance the financial interests of light rail construction firms.
But this will be my final update, because my point is made: Eva Young is a censor who manipulates her discussions to advance her causes. In my particular case, her "cause" is promoting light rail by smearing PRT, and when I point out the obvious flaws in her propaganda, she uses comment moderation to manipulate the debate in her favor.
Lesson: Do not trust political hack blogs like DumpBachmann, and, more generally, never trust any forum moderated by propagandists like Eva Young and Ken Avidor, especially in cases like this where they have a possible financial conflict of interest.
It's too bad that the task of criticising Michele Bachmann, a politician overripe for criticism, falls into the incapable and corrupt hands of the DumpBachmann folks.
Update, 10:21pm EST: My second comment seems to have been ignored, much as the first was for nearly 6 hours. Since I posted the second comment almost 2 hours ago, two other comments from "friendly" jonerik have appeared on the DB, while my comment is still in limbo. Maybe Eva's editing it as we speak, or maybe she's holding onto it for a few more hours until it's stale enough that it doesn't appear on the "recent comments" list.
Update, 8:38pm EST: I have just submitted the following comment to the comments section. Let's see how long it takes to appear. Anyone want to start a pool? :-)
Two questions: (1) Why did it take 6 hours for my comment to appear, and (2) Why did you intersperse your response with mine?
DumpBachmann's comment policy is a joke:
- "moderation" that suppresses comments for hours or even days
- comments (when they finally appear) edited to include inline responses from DB contributors
- premature "closing" of comments sections that are unpleasant to you (this is not even a day old and you are already implying that you will accept no more comments)
- manipulating critical comments so the don't appear on the "recent comments" list on the front page of your blog.
You are all hypocrites for claiming to be open and accepting to all non-abusive comments. This is a propaganda site, pure and simple: you advertise open debate even while secretly manipulating comments behind the scenes. Shame on DumpBachmann, and shame on you Eva.
Update, 8:02pm EST: Now things get interesting! My comment finally appears - but not in its original form! It's been edited so that Eva's response is interspersed inline with my own!
And, of course, her comments don't deny anything, but simply repeat the same old Eva/Avidor anti-PRT talking points. For example, Eva uses the ridiculous tactic of associating PRT with creationism. This tactic was borrowed from Ken's corporate light rail buddies at Light Rail Now, who derisively refer to PRT proponents as "gadgetbahners" and "zealots". She also questions why there would be an "attack blog" against a "private citizen" - conveniently ignoring the fact that Ken Avidor has plastered his image across the Internet as the so-called "leading skeptic" on PRT.
Also notice that my comment has appeared with the original timestamp of nearly 6 hours ago - meaning that it appears way down the list of "recent comments". This is Eva's way of burying my comment so readers can't see it. Contrast this with official DBTO dare2sayit.com, whose comment was approved immediately and appeared at the top of the "recent comments" list.
Eva closes her comment manipulation with this decree:
Further comments on this matter can be taken to weiner watch - not here.
In other words: Eva won't engage in a debate which she cannot win, so even though the original post is less than a day old, she has closed comments.
But I'm not willing to let it end there. Stay tuned. :-)
Update, 7:28pm EST: We're well into our 6th hour waiting for my comment to appear. In the last hour, two additional comments have been approved: one from DB supporter "Doug", and also one from critic "dare2sayit.com", who nicely fills the role of official DumpBachmann token opposition (DBTO).
See, Eva Young wants you to think she allows criticism in her blog comments. So she's found an idealogue blogger from the other side - the official DBTO - whom she regularly props up as evidence that she's not a censor. She even has a link to DBTO's own blog displayed on DB.
Why was dare2sayit selected as DBTO? Simple: because dare2sayit has strong, extreme opinions that are easy to attack and debunk. They'd never have me as DBTO, because my opinions are not extreme, nor do I post ideological rants. My posts are centered in fact, and often debunk their own inflammatory rhetoric.
In short: I will never be DBTO, because they don't want you to see what I write.
I often wonder if dare2sayit is actually a plant - i.e. one of the DB contributors posing as opposition to make the other side to look bad. Normally I wouldn't jump to such conclusions (I like to think that most bloggers are above such petty manipulations), but DumpBachmann contributor Ken Avidor has a long history of such deceptions.
In any case, we now have a total of four comments approved since I submitted mine over five hours ago, including one from the official DBTO, yet mine is still censored.
Update, 6:08pm EST: Exactly four hours have passed, and my comment is still censored. But it's early yet - in the past I've waited days for critical comments to get past the DumpBachmann censors.
Update, 4:55pm EST: Going on three hours now, and my comment is still censored. No other comments have appeared either... I wonder how many other critical comments are "awaiting moderation" along with mine?
Update, 3:58pm EST: Nearly two hours later, and my comment has not yet appeared. In the meantime, two supportive comments from "Eric Z" have appeared on other DumpBachmann posts, so obviously someone is moderating. Conclusion: my comment is currently censored.
Initial post, 2:08pm EST: Ten minutes ago, I submitted a comment to this absurd DumpBachmann post. Now lets watch the DumpBachmann "moderators" (censors) at work.
I'll post updates throughout the day. We'll see how long it takes for my comment to appear, and how many other supportive comments get approved while my criticism is held back. Updates will appear at the top of this entry, so hit the refresh key often!
For reference, here is the comment I posted:
Silliness! Ken Avidor and Eva Young continue to obsess over this one single issue, as if everything can be traced back to PRT. Eva and Ken are obsessed with PRT and anyone involved with it - why is that? Why does this dead issue (dead in Minnesota, at least) continue to inspire Eva and Ken to draw a crooked line from every single politician's failure back to PRT?
What is their motive in all of this? What is the point? Can anyone honestly say that this is the most compelling message to come out of yesterday's newsworthy day in politics?
This blog has an agenda - to discredit PRT and everyone associated with it. I don't know for sure what drives that agenda, but in my experience usually a financial motive is at the heart of such obsessiveness. And we already know that Ken is involved with light rail corporate interests through the astroturfing Light Rail Now site.
What I do know is this: for whatever reason, this relentless agenda has persisted for nearly half a decade, and it is filled with nonsense like this latest post.
Labels: censorship, DumpBachmann, Eva Young, Ken Avidor, propaganda
posted by A Transportation Enthusiast at 1/04/2008 02:02:00 PM
3 Comments:
ATE: Here's your comment. It's not going to get posted on DB because it doesn't address the topic of the post. The topic of the post was NOT discussion of the comment policy - and the thread isn't going to be a repeat of the last thread - which degraded very quickly.
***************************
Two questions: (1) Why did it take 6 hours for my comment to appear, and
I have a day job. Volunteers do comments during the day, and I work on them at night.
(2) Why did you intersperse your response with mine?
EY: To set the record straight - also to end the thread right away. The thread had gotten out of hand the last time - and I was NOT going to allow that to happen again.
ATE:
DumpBachmann's comment policy is a joke: - "moderation" that suppresses comments for hours or even days - comments (when they finally appear) edited to include inline responses from DB contributors - premature "closing" of comments sections that are unpleasant to you (this is not even a day old and you are already implying that you will accept no more comments) - manipulating critical comments so the don't appear on the "recent comments" list on the front page of your blog. You are all hypocrites for claiming to be open and accepting to all non-abusive comments. This is a propaganda site, pure and simple: you advertise open debate even while secretly manipulating comments behind the scenes. Shame on DumpBachmann, and shame on you Eva.
EY: DB contributors - including Avidor are volunteers. Your insinuations that he is being paid to denigrate PRT is a lie - and was a personal attack.
More lies from Eva! I never said he was paid to denigrate PRT - I questioned whether he or his corporate buddies at Light Rail Now profit from his campaign. As I've said before, Dick Cheney can deny that he receives funds directly from Halliburton, but it's clear he is motivated to fill their pockets with government money.
In any case, you've censored my comment again. Not surprised. DumpBachmann is a joke.
Eva's tax payer paid day job doesn't stop her from surfing the web all day. Never has.
Tom Swift (aka Swiftee) called her out on it and, of course Eva removed his comments.
Eva and Ken Weiner are both mentally fragile borderline psychotics that need to be exposed for what and who they are.
Keep up the good work!
Post a Comment
<< Home